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Topic summary

Posted by betony77
 - June 02, 2011, 06:02:57 PM
I agree with Bennu. I am very concerned about the security issues. I know we were all looking around trying to put out the candles and close the windows and such, but we could have overlooked something. If we knew what it was, we would be more observant next time.
Posted by bennuheka
 - June 02, 2011, 05:09:08 PM
I think that it is very important that we know what security discrepancies were overlooked Sunday so that we can all be made aware that they not happen again.  So, if you would be so kind as to list them it would be appreciated.  I know I have come into the grove on a Tuesday to find doors open  and unlocked between the grove space and the parsonage.  I came in a week later on a sunday and found a candle still burning on the threshold altar at the front door.  So these things are important and need to be addressed.

Posted by carynml
 - June 02, 2011, 04:06:31 PM
I feel bad too because I usually think about these things beforehand and make sure that things are in place.  Too many things going on I guess.  However John does have a good point esp since we have moved the whole food service area into the parsonage.  If a person has a key to one then they might as well have a key to the other. 

My 2 cents
Caryn
Posted by debbie
 - June 01, 2011, 10:35:27 PM
"Grumpy old Viking"  ....  :-)   Nay, just a diamond in the rough.
Posted by Crystal
 - June 01, 2011, 11:11:45 AM
I've already stated that I take full responsibility and blame for the Witan side of Sunday :)

It is my fault, no one elses.
Posted by bennuheka
 - June 01, 2011, 11:04:56 AM
Please list all discrepancies of security, so that they are not over looked again.
I was the person who opened the grove.
Ashley, who is a witan member was also present at the grove this past sunday.
Posted by Lokiseinn
 - June 01, 2011, 09:59:45 AM
Quote from: Crystal on May 29, 2011, 09:26:48 PM
Jeff and Courtney are members of the Grove.  Jeff moved to Oregon last March and Courtney has not been around much.

The Grove Warden is an appointed position to someone who lives at the premises (John upstairs) who makes sure things are secure while we are not at the Grove space and also has a key to let folks in when needed (and they have permission to be let in, he always asks us first or we let him know ahead of time).
While I am usually informed of the Grove needing to opened, I was not aware of the problem on Sunday until Erin received a call at 11am.  She informed the caller that I was asleep, however they continued to insist that I be awoken as they did not have access to the parsonage and they thought I might have a key (which I do).   

The Grove member who opened the Grove space did not possess a key to the parsonage.  They also didn't stay around to close up, instead leaving one person by themselves working on the plants.  When doing my post-gathering security check I  found several discrepancies.

I know I've said this before, and I understand that people get busy and forget, but it really is important that I be made aware when the Grove is going to be in use without a Witan member or their designee present. 

I also feel I should be made aware of just who is running around with Grove keys that are not on the Witan and are authorized to open and be in the Grove.  It seems to me that if you are authorized to open the Grove, you should be able to access all its facilities.

Last but certainly not least, if you are authorized and choose to open the Grove, then it is your respopnsibility to see that it is properly secured at the end of the gathering.

I've tried to word this so it doesn't sound angry, because I am not.  I do however take the security of the Grove very seriously.  I'm also a grumpy old viking, so please forgive the tone if it upsets.

Posted by Crystal
 - May 29, 2011, 09:26:48 PM
Jeff and Courtney are members of the Grove.  Jeff moved to Oregon last March and Courtney has not been around much.

The Grove Warden is an appointed position to someone who lives at the premises (John upstairs) who makes sure things are secure while we are not at the Grove space and also has a key to let folks in when needed (and they have permission to be let in, he always asks us first or we let him know ahead of time).
Posted by betony77
 - May 29, 2011, 08:59:24 PM
Small question by a newbie - who are Jeff and Courtney? Also, who and what is the Grove Warden?
Posted by Crystal
 - May 29, 2011, 07:47:06 PM
Yeah not all of these little stipulations will be (or should be) in the bylaws.  That's why we need a membership manual! lol *runs off to work on it some*
Posted by lindowyn
 - May 29, 2011, 05:11:47 PM
QuoteFor clarification as well, since it was asked of me this morning, a Witan member does not have to be present at every event at the Grove, so long as we have designated someone else to be there in our stead.  Jeff and Courtney have both run WWTOO before, and we had the Grove Warden open the Grove space, when the Witan was not able to be there.

All of this with understanding, my concerns lay with the fact that no one had been designated to be there in our stead. I was mistaken, but I was always under the impression that the purpose of having a Witan member present at all functions was to be present in case something of a litigious nature were too occur. (If someone were to get injured by tripping over a rock...or if there was a physical fight.) If no one was there to record or witness the event in an appointed or official capacity, it could mean trouble for us on a grander scale.

No, we aren't babysitters and yes we're all adults here, but we cannot guarantee who will be there and who will not be; the danger of having an open door policy. When I had taken this oath I made it with this understanding in mind, so I feel bound to it regardless. There is no one that requires blame or apology; I made that choice.

There is nothing in the bylaws that states anything either way that I can find which I think is interesting. I also cannot find anything in the bylaws that state that a Grove member or Witan member must be present for an event in which the space was rented etc. Perhaps I am looking in the wrong place? Although there is something in there that says the Grove will pay for the Witan's membership fees. *snicker* Oh, well.

We lived through it. And someone came by today to give us sticks from their backyard. Yepyep. Sticks.

Posted by Crystal
 - May 29, 2011, 11:37:00 AM
So there was a big mix-up today on the Witan regarding who would be there to help oversee things.

I unfortunately had to work today, Caryn is at Wellspring, and Ashley is sick.

Ashley is coming down to close up, though I did offer to come down in her stead to just close and come right back home, but she has volunteered her sick self to do this very generously.

So I'm making my own formal apology for not organizing this weekend better for the Grove and taking full responsibility.  We just didn't think about it, I think.

I've been taking on work on the weekends because I owe a debt to Caryn and Will, and with Will losing his job I feel it is my duty to work as hard as i can to pay my debt to them back ASAP.  But I am apparently working -too- hard because I'm missing out on my obligations, for which I am very sorry for.

So I am telling my client that has been working me to death the last two weeks that I can no longer work on weekends.

For clarification as well, since it was asked of me this morning, a Witan member does not have to be present at every event at the Grove, so long as we have designated someone else to be there in our stead.  Jeff and Courtney have both run WWTOO before, and we had the Grove Warden open the Grove space, when the Witan was not able to be there.

This is also why we state that groups that wish to rent our space must have a Grove member present or sponsoring the activity, not just a Witan member.  If an outside group wants to run a monthly workshop, if one of our members is always present and approved by the Witan, then that member is responsible for making sure things are cleaned up at the end of the day and secure.  So no, a Witan member doesn't always have to be present, even though we "try" to be as much as we can.

So again, I apologize, and I will hopefully be available more often now.  I still won't be coming to events during the work week, that's just too much when I live an hour and a half away, but weekends I should be fine.